Chinese Chengdu J-20 stealth fighter

Rappel du premier message :

1er Avion de 5éme génération chinois

il sont en retard mais ont tous pour devenir grand (moyen financier , materiel humains)

mais aujourd hui , oui ils sont en retard.

image trouve dans un image board japonais

brk195 a écrit:

image trouve dans un image board japonais

C'est moi ou bien les ouvertures pour train d'atterrissage ont été grossièrement opérées sur le fuselage de l'appareil ( qui paraît bien fragile sur cette photo soit-dit en passant )

Je laisse ici quelques photos,







et une vidéo, aujourd'hui (il est intéressant jour 11-1-11) s'est tenue à l'aérodrome de Chengdu, en Chine (où il a son siège social usine CCS Huang Tian Ba à l'aéroport) le premier vol du nouveau chasseur de 5e génération chinoise de Chengdu J-20 "Black Eagle".
Ce chasseur de nouvelles chinois, enregistré en 2001, a décollé à 12h50 (heure locale), devant des centaines de fonctionnaires et invités.
L'avion transportait trois lignes de la circulation autour de l'aérodrome d'être escorté par un chasseur J-10S, avec une fiche de 220, avant d'atterrir à environ 13:08.
Le premier vol a coïncidé avec la visite du secrétaire à la Défense Robert Gates à la Chine. Sécurité a été renforcée à l'aérodrome pour effectuer le premier vol.

La vidéo non officielle de l'atterrissage et le décollage court de ce vol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfPbf3Ob_1M&feature=player_embedded

Dejitaiza a écrit:

C'est moi ou bien les ouvertures pour train d'atterrissage ont été grossièrement opérées sur le fuselage de l'appareil ( qui paraît bien fragile sur cette photo soit-dit en passant )

Ca arrive souvant aux jouets Made In China.

en tout cas cet avion ne m'inspire pas confiance, mais attendons les données et performances quand il sera vraiment opérationnel.

[quote="Dejitaiza"]

brk195 a écrit:

image trouve dans un image board japonais


C'est moi ou bien les ouvertures pour train d'atterrissage ont été grossièrement opérées sur le fuselage de l'appareil ( qui paraît bien fragile sur cette photo soit-dit en passant )

les ouvertures sont comme ca pour une raison c'est le sawtooth design qui se trouve dans les avions furtifs

Dejitaiza a écrit:

C'est moi ou bien les ouvertures pour train d'atterrissage ont été grossièrement opérées sur le fuselage de l'appareil ( qui paraît bien fragile sur cette photo soit-dit en passant )

dents de scie propres a la furtivité,les chinois ont bien compris le procedé.

Fremo a écrit:

2 New videos
http://www.56.com/u78/v_NTc3MTY2Mjc.html
http://www.56.com/u38/v_NTc3NTI3NTU.html

j ajoute une autre vidéo : http://www.56.com/u45/v_NTc3NTI4NTA.html

nouveau Topic des posts deplacés,l´avion en merite un

Artist´s impression


analyse de Flightglobal sur la furtivité ou non du J20.

Citation :

J-20 post flight celebration photos


China Defense Blog has posted three photos from the post flight celebration of the J-20, officially called Project 718





Party like 1949



The banner reads: Warmly Celebrate Engineering Project 718 Prototype 01 Maiden Flight

The 1 star general standing in the middle of the first celebration pic is Ma Jianmin, principle of the PLAAF command academy (Kong Jun Zhi Hui Xue Yuan).*

* Thanks to COWlan for pointing he out.

china-defense.blogspot

Citation :

Stealthy Chinese J-20 Vulnerable


Jan 14, 2011

By David A. Fulghum, Bill Sweetman, Bradley Perrett, Robert Wall Washington, Washington, Beijing, London

China’s newest combat aircraft prototype, the J-20, will require an intense development program if it is going to catch up with fast-moving anti-stealth advances. In fact, anti-stealth will bring into question all stealth designs: How much invulnerability will current low-observability techniques offer as air defense systems adopt larger and more powerful active, electronically scanned array (AESA) radars? From the early days of AESA development, a key goal was to build a radar that could detect very small objects—such as a cruise missile at a distance great enough to target and shoot it down—or a larger object like a fighter with a very low-observable treatment. Airborne detection of stealth aircraft may already be an operational capability. In a series of tests at Edwards AFB, Calif., in 2009, Lockheed Martin’s CATbird avionics testbed—a Boeing 737 that carries the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter’s entire avionics system—engaged a mixed force of F-22s and Boeing F-15s and was able to locate and jam F-22 radars, according to researchers. Raytheon’s family of X-band airborne AESA radar—in particular, those on upgraded F-15Cs stationed in Okinawa—can detect small, low-signature cruise missiles. Moreover, Northrop Grumman’s lower-frequency, L-band AESA radar on Australia’s Wedgetail airborne early warning and control aircraft is larger and potentially more capable of detecting stealth aircraft at longer ranges. Lockheed Martin also hinted at a JSF anti-stealth capability in 2009 in a reference to combat with sophisticated, foreign aircraft. “The F-35’s avionics include onboard sensors that will enable pilots to strike fixed or moving ground targets in high-threat environments, day or night, in any weather, while simultaneously targeting and eliminating advanced airborne threats,” said Dan Crowley, then-executive vice president and F-35 program general manager. Better images emerging from China point clearly to the J-20’s use of stealth technology, but major uncertainties and questions remain unresolved. The overall shape resembles that of the F-35 and F-22, which have a single “chine line” uniting the forebody, upper inlet lips, and wing and canard edges with a curved surface above that line and flat, canted body surfaces below it. The wing and canard edges are aligned: The wing and canard leading edges are parallel and the trailing edge of each canard is aligned with the opposite wing’s trailing edge. The same basic philosophy also has been adopted in British, Swedish and Japanese studies for stealth fighters. The aim in all cases is to endow a practical, agile fighter configuration with a “bow-tie” radar signature, with the smallest signature around the nose and the greatest (still much lower than that of a conventional aircraft with curved or vertical-slab sides) to the side. The fighter’s mission planning system, using a database of known radar locations, then derives a “blue line” track that weaves between radars and avoids exposing the side-on signature to those radars more than transiently. The “diverterless” supersonic inlet avoids a signature problem caused by a conventional boundary layer diverter plate. For example, the F-22 has a conventional inlet, which is likely to require extensive radar absorbent material (RAM) treatment. The biggest uncertainty about the Chinese design concerns the engine exhausts, which as seen on the prototype are likely to cause a radar cross-section (RCS) peak from the rear aspect. One possibility is that a stealthier two-dimensional nozzle will be integrated later in the program; however, the nozzles on the current aircraft show some signs of RCS-reducing sawtooth treatment, suggesting that the People’s Liberation Army has accepted a rear-aspect RCS penalty rather than the much greater weight and complexity of 2D nozzles.

Other features are less clear. Stealth development has been dogged by detail-design challenges. All the antennas on the aircraft have to be flush with the skin and covered with surfaces that retain stealth properties while being transparent in a specific frequency. Maintainability becomes a complex tradeoff: Some systems requiring frequent attention will be accessed via landing gear and weapon bays, and others by latched and actuated doors that can open and close without affecting RCS—but the latter involves a weight penalty.
Perhaps the toughest hurdle is managing radio-frequency surface currents over the skin. Early stealth designs used heavy, maintenance-intensive RAM. The F-22 introduced a much lighter surface treatment, but it has proven unexpectedly difficult to maintain, causing corrosion issues. Lockheed Martin now asserts that the F-35 will be robust and affordable to maintain in service, with a combination of a high-toughness, sprayed-on topcoat and a conductive layer cured into composite skin panels.
The Chengdu J-20 design has struck many analysts and observers as familiar and somewhat different from the F-22, F-35 or Sukhoi T-50.
“The J-20 is reminiscent of the Russian MiG-1.42 both in terms of planform and also with regard to the rear fuselage configuration,” says Douglas Barrie, senior fellow for military aerospace at London’s International Institute for Strategic Studies. “The most obvious difference is the greater forward fuselage shaping as the basis for low-observable characteristics, along with the different engine intake configuration. The MiG program was canceled by the Russian government around 1997,” he notes. However, the similarity to the MiG concept may suggest some collusion with the Russian aviation industry.
The J-20 made its first flight shortly before 1 p.m. Beijing time on Jan. 11. The flight ended three weeks of anticipation that began in late December when the new design started taxi tests.
The discussion about the program will now shift to the aircraft’s mission (fighter or, more likely, long-range strike), sensors (strike missions would require a high-resolution, long-range radar) and communications (which would demand high-speed data links and sophisticated integration).
Conventional radars have only one-half to one-third of the range of an AESA radar. Moreover, the movement of a conventional, mechanically scanned radar antenna provides a tell-tale glint of radio-frequency reflections to enemy aircraft with advanced radars. Such reflections undercut the effectiveness of a stealth airframe. China is known to be pursuing newer radar technology.
“It’s too early to tell the true status of the Chinese AESA program,” says a Washington-based intelligence official. “We’ve seen lots of press and air show information on the program, but that doesn’t automatically translate into a robust development or give us an accurate look at where [China] is as far as fielding one anytime soon.
“Like the [high-performance] engine, it’ll be a challenge to take the step from older radars to one designed for a fifth-generation fighter,” he says. “Again, though, the J-20 is just the first or second—depending on whom you believe—prototype in a very long development program.”
If the Chinese conduct a few months of flight tests and there are no more aircraft involved in the program, this might indicate that the J-20 is a proof-of-concept or technical demonstrator. If there are several aircraft eventually, a prototype program would be a more likely conclusion.
The flight occurred during a visit to China by U.S. Defense Secretary Robert Gates, who says Chinese President Hu Jintao confirmed the event to him in talks. However, Gates still believes the U.S. will retain a preponderance of stealth fighters through 2025.

aviationweek.com

bien sur hihihi

Sincerement les chinois m'inpressionnent il apprennent(ou copie ) très vite
Comme dirai Napoléon "quand la chine s'éveillera le monde tremblera"

lemay a écrit:

je suis tout à fait d'accord je ne denigre pas leurs efforts mais question technologie de pointe ils sont loin bien loin c'est un constat et fait en fait il y renault actuellement qui s'est faite espionner par les chintoks donc meme technologie des voitures elle est tres en retard de là à passer aux technologies de pointe ils ne sont meme pas capable d'egaler coté performence le AL31 fabriqué en chine avec le russe alors qu'il s'agit d'un reacteur des années 80

tant que il sont une puissance militaire dissuasif je crois que ils auront toute la liberté d'avancé comme il veulent c'est la pays qui rend compte a personne surtout que maintenant c'est un pays qui offre plus de crédit au autres pays que la banque mondial parmis eux des grandes nation telle que l'espagne le portugal et d'autre ...

De nombreux experts signalent que le Gap technologique entre l'occident et la Chine, est volontairement maintenue par cette dernière ( Avec les capitaux qu'elle possède et le savoir-faire acqui jusqu'à aujourd'hui, les chinois pourraient massivement investir dans la R&D et rattrappé leur retard en moin d'une génération).
Pékin ne souhaitrait pas être perçue comme une menace direct par les autres grandes puissances, et jouerait la montre pour assurer d'abord son approvisionnement en matière première ( son économie en dépend énormément).

Ensuite.....

Citation :

China's new stealth jet may use technology from downed US F-117, officials say

BRUSSELS - Chinese officials recently unveiled a new, high-tech stealth fighter that could pose a significant threat to American air superiority — and some of its technology, it turns out, may well have come from the U.S. itself.
Balkan military officials and other experts have told The Associated Press that in all probability the Chinese gleaned some of their technological know-how from an American F-117 Nighthawk that was shot down over Serbia in 1999.
Nighthawks were the world's first stealth fighters, planes that were very hard for radar to detect. But on March 27, 1999, during NATO's aerial bombing of Serbia in the Kosovo war, a Serbian anti-aircraft missile shot one of the Nighthawks down. The pilot ejected and was rescued.
It was the first time one of the much-touted "invisible" fighters had ever been hit. The Pentagon believed a combination of clever tactics and sheer luck had allowed a Soviet-built SA-3 missile to bring down the jet.
The wreckage was strewn over a wide area of flat farmlands, and civilians collected the parts — some the size of small cars — as souvenirs.
"At the time, our intelligence reports told of Chinese agents crisscrossing the region where the F-117 disintegrated, buying up parts of the plane from local farmers," says Adm. Davor Domazet-Loso, Croatia's military chief of staff during the Kosovo war.
"We believe the Chinese used those materials to gain an insight into secret stealth technologies ... and to reverse-engineer them," Domazet-Loso said in a telephone interview.
A senior Serbian military official confirmed that pieces of the wreckage were removed by souvenir collectors, and that some ended up "in the hands of foreign military attaches."
Efforts to get comment from China's defence ministry and the Pentagon were unsuccessful.
China's multi-role stealth fighter — known as the Chengdu J-20 — made its inaugural flight Jan. 11, revealing dramatic progress in the country's efforts to develop cutting-edge military technologies.
Although the twin-engine J-20 is at least eight or nine years from entering air force inventory, it could become a rival to America's top-of-the-line F-22 Raptor, the successor to the Nighthawk and the only stealth fighter currently in service.
China rolled out the J-22 just days before a visit to Beijing by U.S. Defence Secretary Robert Gates, leading some analysts to speculate that the timing was intended to demonstrate the growing might of China's armed forces.
Despite Chinese President Hu Jintao's high-profile visit to the United States this week, many in Washington see China as an economic threat to the U.S. and worry as well about Beijing's military might.
Parts of the downed F-117 wreckage — such as the left wing with US Air Force insignia, the cockpit canopy, ejection seat, pilot's helmet and radio — are exhibited at Belgrade's aviation museum.
"I don't know what happened to the rest of the plane," said Zoran Milicevic, deputy director of the museum. "A lot of delegations visited us in the past, including the Chinese, Russians and Americans ... but no one showed any interest in taking any part of the jet."
Zoran Kusovac, a Rome-based military consultant, said the regime of former Serbian President Slobodan Milosevic routinely shared captured Western equipment with its Chinese and Russian allies.
"The destroyed F-117 topped that wish-list for both the Russians and Chinese," Milicevic said.
Russia's Sukhoi T-50 prototype stealth fighter made its maiden flight last year and is due to enter service in about four years. It is likely that the Russians also gleaned knowledge of stealth technology from the downed Nighthawk.
The F-117, developed in great secrecy in the 1970s, began service in 1983.
While not completely invisible to radar, its shape and radar-absorbent coating made detection extremely difficult. The radar cross-section was further reduced because the wings' leading and trailing edges were composed of nonmetallic honeycomb structures that do not reflect radar rays.
Kusovac said insight into this critical technology, and particularly the plane's secret radiation-absorbent exterior coating, would have significantly enhanced China's stealth know-how.
Alexander Huang of Taipei's Tamkang University said the J-20 represented a major step forward for China. He described Domazet-Loso's claim as "a logical assessment."
"There is no other stronger source for the origin of the J-20's stealthy technology," said Huang, an expert on China's air force. "The argument the Croatian chief-of-staff makes is legitimate and cannot be ruled out."
The Chinese are well-known perpetrators of industrial espionage in Western Europe and the United States, where the administration has also been increasingly aggressive in prosecuting cases of Chinese espionage.
Western diplomats have said China maintained an intelligence post in its Belgrade embassy during the Kosovo war. The building was mistakenly struck by U.S. bombers that May, killing three people inside.
"What that means is that the Serbs and Chinese would have been sharing their intelligence," said Alexander Neill, head of the Asia security program at the Royal United Services Institute, a defencethink-tank in London. "It's very likely that they shared the technology they recovered from the F-117, and it's very plausible that elements of the F-117 got to China."

http://www.news889.com/news/world/article/173194--china-s-new-stealth-jet-may-use-technology-from-downed-us-f-117-officials-say

Citation :

New Details On China's J-20 Fighter Provide More Nuanced View Of Threat

Aerospace experts scrutinizing images of the Chinese J-20 fighter that first began appearing on the internet in late December have developed a more nuanced view of the plane's features than what was available in early reports. Although the J-20 resembles the outline of the stealthy F-22 Raptor when viewed head-on in its forward aspect, the plane clearly lacks many of the features that make Raptor the most capable air-to-air combat system in history. On the other hand, these same experts believe that over time the Peoples Liberation Army Air Force can evolve the J-20 into a formidable combat aircraft -- especially given the fact that it is expected to operate in or near Chinese airspace, where it will greatly outnumber any attacker's planes.

Early reports that the J-20 exceeds 70 feet in length appear to be wrong. By comparing the scale of the aircraft with adjacent reference objects whose dimensions are known, experts have determined that the fighter is 62 feet long -- the same length as the F-22, and not much different from the 64 feet of the F-15C fighter. Based on overhead imagery and other inputs, wingspan looks to be about 41 feet, also similar to F-22 (45 feet) and F-15C (43 feet). However, the wing area of roughly 630 square feet much more closely resembles the 608 square feet of the F-15C than the 840 square feet on the F-22; this matters a great deal in terms of range since fuel is stored in wing areas.

The J-20's top speed is judged to be below Mach 2, meaning it is significantly slower than an F-22 or F-15C. Little is known about the performance features of the J-20's twin jets, which may be based on technology from the western CFM-56 commercial powerplant first exported 30 years ago. The steady-state thrust provided by the engines is probably similar to the 29,000 lbs of the F-15C, but greatly inferior to the 48,000 lbs generated by the two F119 engines on the Raptor (J-20 maximum thrust of 60,000 lbs comes closer to the 70,000 lbs of F-22, and surpasses the 48,000 lbs of F-15C). The J-20 does not have the supercruise feature of the F-22 that allows the latter plane to fly at high speed without consuming excessive amounts of fuel, which puts the J-20 at a decided disadvantage given that it carries about 25 percent less fuel internally than the F-22. It also does not have the vectored thrust of the F-22 that provides enhanced aerial agility; the Chinese appear to have modified the fixed exhaust nozzles on the J-20 with an eye to misleading western observers concerning how capable the propulsion system is.

The J-20 airframe incorporates extensive low-observable (stealth) technology into its forward aspect, although it is more readily tracked from side and rear angles. However, even in the forward aspect some design features such as the engine inlets appear sub-optimized for reduction of radar cross-section. It is not clear how extensively designers have used radar-absorbing materials. It is also not clear what kinds of on-board electronics the J-20 will eventually carry in its operational configuration. Electronic sensors, processors and datalinks are the heart of the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, greatly surpassing the performance of even those on the F-22.

While the J-20 superficially resembles fifth-generation fighters such as the F-22 and F-35, experts do not believe Chinese designers will be able to produce an airframe that comes close to matching the maneuverability, survivability, lethality or situational awareness of an F-22 or F-35. However, they may not need to if they can lure enemy fighters into Chinese airspace where they have other "home court" advantages.

defpro

transferé,y´a un topic special pour

encore

Yakuza a écrit:

transferé,y´a un topic special pour

-ca n´equipe pas l´armée chinoise encore.
-y´a d´autres topics sepcifiques,priere d´y preter plus d´attention.

J-20 flyby April 17 2011 歼-20 4月17日试飞

Citation :

The J-20's emergence has prompted several other nations to step up their air force modernisation activities. Japan earlier this month issued a request for proposals in a contest to replace its oldest McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantoms, despite having to recover from the effects of a devastating earthquake and tsunami. Candidates for its F-X fighter requirement include the Boeing F/A-18E/F Super Hornet, Eurofighter Typhoon and the Lockheed F-35.
Taiwan also has stepped up its efforts to get the US government to approve its long-stalled request for an additional batch of 66 Lockheed F-16C/D fighters.
DATE:20/04/11
SOURCE:Flight International

Citation :

J-20

Il est gigantesque !

Je me demande quel sera sa capacité d'emport et ses capacités Air-Sol ?

Ca pourrait facilement etre un bombardier