Armée Indienne / Indian Armed Forces

Euh........ Typhoon pour moi .

Moi, je vois plutôt le Rafale. Je pense que les indiens ont plus à y gagner, sauf si Dassault a encore fait des siennes.

La France a eu la modernisation des 2000 plus le contrat des Scorpéne,aprés les 2 avions se sont bien comportés en Lybie mais mon eternel pessimisme guette.........

je crains que cette phrase

Citation :

After all, the employees of the two contenders are keen to enjoy the holiday season.

tend vers le EF,comme quoi les francais ont eu bcp de claques derniers temps,on veut pas encore leur bousiller le noel avec une enieme

ils ne veulent pas d'un chasseur navalisable ?!!

Le Rafale ne peut avoir une place dans un appel d'offre concernant un chasseur pour la Navy ... tout simplement, les projet des PA indiens, portent tous sur des batiment STOBAR et non CATOBAR.

L'Inde a opté pour le Mig29K, et travaille aussi sur un projet de navalisation du Tejas.

En plus la poussé du rafale ne lui permettrait jamais de décoller du PA indien.

L'appel d'offre pour la compétition MMRCA (Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft) est à l'initiative et ne concerne que l'armée de l'air indienne.

Citation :

PM to raise Su-30 MKI engine failure with Russia

Prime Minister Manmohan Singh is expected to red-flag serviceability, product support and pending upgrade of India's frontline Su-30 MKI multi-role fighter with President Dmitry Medvedev at the annual summit meeting on Friday in Russia.


Top government sources said that Air Headquarters has


While the Indian Air Force is tight-lipped about the issue and would like to play it down, the top brass has conveyed to government that "shaft bearing failures" have occurred in some engines. "In peacetime, the fighter can land on the other engine but this can be a life and death situation in adverse conditions, said a senior official.

India to provide new nuclear reactor site for Russia
Sources said that IAF had conveyed to the Russian manufacturer of Su-30 MKI that it needed to make design changes to prevent any future engine failures. However, the manufacturer raised objections to the lubricants used by the IAF in the Su-30 MKI engine. But after it was proved that the engine was still failing despite the use of oil recommended by the manufacturer, the IAF decide to escalate the matter to the government level. Since it was inducted in 1997, Su-30 MKI has performed well with IAF despite three crashes, none of which have been attributed to engine failures.

The other issue of concern is the pending upgrade for Su-30MKI fighters, which have now been in IAF service for over eight years. While the Air Headquarters wants the manufacturer to upgrade avionics and weapon platforms, the matter is stuck not on technical but on the commercial aspects as the original manufacturer is bargaining hard for better price.

hindustantimes.com

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Russia to provide additional 42 Sukhoi fighters to India


Russia will provide an additional 42 Sukhoi frontline fighters to India under an agreement signed today, taking the bilateral defence cooperation to new heights.

With this pact, the total number of acquired or contracted aircraft by India in various stages of manufacture of the frontline SU-30 MKI fighters increases to 272.

The agreement for the upgraded Sukhois was signed by Defence Secretary Shashi Kant Sharma and Russian Federal Service for Military-technical Cooperation Director MA Dmitriev in the presence of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and President Dmitry Medvedev after their talks at the 12th annual Indo-Russian Summit at the Kremlin.

The pact, which was among the five agreements initialled between the two countries, came against the backdrop of a crash of an Indian Air Force's Sukhoi-30 near Pune.

The mishap, in which the two pilots ejected safely, raised some technical questions and also led to the grounding of the entire fleet of 120 planes pending investigations.

An Inter-Governmental Agreement (IGA) and a general contract were signed in 2000 for the manufacture of 140 Su-30 MKI aircraft by HAL. A 2007 protocol envisaged manufacture of a further 40 aircraft.

Earlier, 50 Su-30 aircraft were purchased in phases prior to the signing of the IGA and the deliveries started in the late 90s.

The new version is expected to include a new cockpit, an upgraded radar and certain stealth features to avoid radar detection.

Significantly, the upgraded Sukhoi-30 MKIs will be able to carry a heavier weapons load, especially the airborne version of the Brahmos cruise missile. India is also looking to upgrade most of its SU-30 MKIs in the long run.

The first delivery of the upgraded Sukhois is expected in 2014 and the last by 2018.

According to present projections, India plans to phase out 120 MiG 21s by 2017 and with the MMRCA still not a done deal, the SU-30 MKI fleet will be the mainstay.

At their joint press conference, Medvedev said Indo-Russian Military-Technical Cooperation has reached "unprecedented levels" while Prime Minister Singh saidthis has reached 'qualitatively new levels."

dnaindia

pyromane a écrit:

En plus la poussé du rafale ne lui permettrait jamais de décoller du PA indien.

donc si je te comprend bien le Rafale M serait moins puissant qu'un mig 29 K ?

tu as des chiffres à l'appui de tes dires?

Plus de poussée pour moins de rayon d'action ............cruelle dilemne.

Voici les caractéristiques que publie le constructeur au sujet de son avion, le MiG-29K...

http://www.migavia.ru/eng/military_e/MiG_29_K_KUB_e.htm

Il s'agit donc pour cet avion de 2 Klimov RD-33MK x 9000 kgf (avec réchauffe).

L'info chez le constructeur des moteurs...

http://en.klimov.ru/production/aircraft/RD-33MK

thierrytigerfan a écrit:

pyromane a écrit:

En plus la poussé du rafale ne lui permettrait jamais de décoller du PA indien.

donc si je te comprend bien le Rafale M serait moins puissant qu'un mig 29 K ?

tu as des chiffres à l'appui de tes dires?

le mig29k a une poussé supérieure de 20% au rafale (2x9000kN contre 2x7500kN), t'as qu'à explorer les sources de rafi

et même sur le CDG, il utilise un train sauteur (compression de l'amortisseur du train avant par la catapulte) pour avoir l'incidence nécessaire pour pouvoir voler, chose qu'il n'aura pas sur le PA indien puisqu'il n'y a pas de catapulte.

chose qui permet au Rafale d'avoir une charge utile plus importante que les chasseurs emarqués russes qui sont toujours "light" coté armement.

Je suis d'accord fremo, mais n’empêche que le rafale M est totalement inadapté au PA indien, et a très peu de chance de connaitre l'export un jour.

Voici pour rappel les caractéristiques que donne le constructeur au sujet de son avion, le Su-33...

http://www.sukhoi.org/eng/planes/military/su33/lth

inadapté pour des raisons que j'ai déjà cité, structurelles en premier lieu.

chance à l'export ... il existe, principalement le marché brésilien !! mais c'est HS ici.

Citation :

Indian Navy developing new stealth ships


Click to play video

New Delhi: The Indian naval designers have been working on cutting edge ships of the future. CNN-IBN caught up with naval experts at the President's Fleet Review to find out what the Indian navy fleet will look like, 10 years from now.

The Indian Navy will have a three hulled ship or the Trimaran virtually invisible to the enemy radar because of its stealth design. Its deck gun and missiles have been concealed in every respect.

KN Vaidyanathan, DG, Naval Design, said, "Stealth means reduced radar cross section, reduced underwater noise as well as reduced infrared signature apart from other electric signatures."

"We are also going to use multi-function radars, already our destroyers and new gen frigates are going to have multi-function radars and they are using the vertical launch systems," he added.

The Trimaran concept design follows in the wake of the Navy's first stealth design, the Project 17 Shivalik class ships, two of which are now at sea with a third on the way.

But the Navy is banking on the Shivalik's successor, the Project 17 Alfa stealth vessel, which will have missile silos flush with the deck and torpedo launchers blending along the sides of the vessel. There will also be a concealed hangar for a Kamov helicopter. Naval designers admit that US concepts have influenced some of their ideas.

"If you look at the LCS design of the US Navy, they are moving on the seaframe concept and mission modularity.The idea is to have a basic seaframe for the platform and have a mission module so that you can have role changes for the ship and there can be a quick turnaround of roles," Vaidyanathan said.

With an eye on the future, the Navy is moving towards modular construction and may even participate in Britain's Global Combat Ship project where individual navies can use a common low cost platform to fit their own weapons and systems.

ibnlive

pyromane a écrit:

thierrytigerfan a écrit:

pyromane a écrit:

En plus la poussé du rafale ne lui permettrait jamais de décoller du PA indien.

donc si je te comprend bien le Rafale M serait moins puissant qu'un mig 29 K ?

tu as des chiffres à l'appui de tes dires?

le mig29k a une poussé supérieure de 20% au rafale (2x9000kN contre 2x7500kN), t'as qu'à explorer les sources de rafi

et même sur le CDG, il utilise un train sauteur (compression de l'amortisseur du train avant par la catapulte) pour avoir l'incidence nécessaire pour pouvoir voler, chose qu'il n'aura pas sur le PA indien puisqu'il n'y a pas de catapulte.

l'argument de la catapulte tient la route si les hindous font des porte aéronefs sans catapulte ce qui semble bien être le cas
mais si l'inde fait des portes aéronefs avec catapultes , je suis persuadé que le rafale serait choisi, d'abord la modernité de l'avion et de ses systemes, ensuite s'il est moins bien pourvus en puissance il a les jambes plus longues et une capacité d'emport plus large que le mig 29
en ce qi concernne le train avant jusqu'a preuve du contraire tout les avions qui utilisent la catapulte sur PA ont un train qui se compresse que ce soit le F-18 ou le Rafale ou le E-2D ca ne degrade en rien les performances de l'avion

Un qu'il ne faut pas sous estimer s'il réussit à s'imposer dans ses versions dédiées aux PA, c'est bien le F-35 qui lui répond tant au besoin d'un porte-avions du type CATOBAR que d'un porte aéronef du type STOBAR.

Citation :

PICTURE: MiG-29K gets on board Indian aircraft carrier


With work on the Indian navy's future aircraft carrier the INS Vikramaditya now 90% complete, an RSK MiG-29K fighter has been placed aboard the vessel for the first time.

Pictured on the carrier's deck at the Sevmash dockyard in Severodvinsk, northern Russia during November, aircraft Side 311 was deployed using a crane to serve as a mock-up only.

According to Sevmash, the Vikramaditya will start sea trials in May 2012, with these to involve take-offs and landings using two industry-owned aircraft. One is a purpose-built MiG-29K, while the other is a MiG-35D two-seat demonstrator now being modified after the crash of a MiG-29KUB trainer during trials in 2011

© Vladamir Karnozov

Originally introduced to service with the Russian navy in 1987 as the Baku, but deactivated in 1992, the modified Vikramaditya now features a "ski-jump" ramp and three arrestor wires to support fighter operations. New Delhi's total investment in the ship is worth around $2 billion, with Sevmash expecting it to be commissioned into service on 4 December 2012 - Indian navy day.

Russia has so far delivered 11 of the 16 MiG-29K/KUBs ordered for the Indian navy under a 2003 deal worth $530 million, with the remainder due to be shipped to Goa before the end of 2011.

India also this year firmed up an option for 29 more navalised MiG-29s to equip its future homegrown aircraft carriers.

flightglobal

thierrytigerfan a écrit:

pyromane a écrit:

thierrytigerfan a écrit:

donc si je te comprend bien le Rafale M serait moins puissant qu'un mig 29 K ?

tu as des chiffres à l'appui de tes dires?

le mig29k a une poussé supérieure de 20% au rafale (2x9000kN contre 2x7500kN), t'as qu'à explorer les sources de rafi

et même sur le CDG, il utilise un train sauteur (compression de l'amortisseur du train avant par la catapulte) pour avoir l'incidence nécessaire pour pouvoir voler, chose qu'il n'aura pas sur le PA indien puisqu'il n'y a pas de catapulte.

l'argument de la catapulte tient la route si les hindous font des porte aéronefs sans catapulte ce qui semble bien être le cas
mais si l'inde fait des portes aéronefs avec catapultes , je suis persuadé que le rafale serait choisi, d'abord la modernité de l'avion et de ses systemes, ensuite s'il est moins bien pourvus en puissance il a les jambes plus longues et une capacité d'emport plus large que le mig 29
en ce qi concernne le train avant jusqu'a preuve du contraire tout les avions qui utilisent la catapulte sur PA ont un train qui se compresse que ce soit le F-18 ou le Rafale ou le E-2D ca ne degrade en rien les performances de l'avion

En fait c'est simple, il n'y a que deux pays au monde qui mettent service des PA CATOBAR, la France et les USA, les russes qui sont les plus gros fournisseurs ne maitrisent pas totalement la technologie du CATOBAR, donc on n'est pas prêt de voir les indiens avec ce genre de PA, sauf revirement stratégique, ce qui reste peu probable, bien sur je parle dans pour la décennie qui vient pas dans 30 ans.

voici un article de l'indian defence review qui donne une vision sur les orientations stratégique de l'armée indienne :
http://www.indiandefencereview.com/military-and-aerospace/Indian-Army-2020.html

L'INS Vikrant en construction dans les installations de Cochin. Il s'agit en fait du premier des 2 PA STOBAR indiens en construction. L'Inde a fait appel aux italiens pour l'assistance technique, surtout au niveau de la motorisation, on voit aussi du dessin en bas, qu'il a un air de ressemblance avec le nouveau porte-aéronefs italien.



le tableau ci-dessous, fait une comparaison entre le Cavour, et les 2 PA que l'Inde s'apprête à recevoir, le Vikramaditya et le Vikrant

Photos prises lors du Presidential Fleet Review 2011 :

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NAVY/Galleries/News/Events/PFR2011/

en 2003 si ma mémoire est bonne, la frégate Lt Cl Errahmani a participé à un évenement pareil au large de Mumbay ...

Citation :

Elecon to supply gears for India's first aircraft carrier

Gujarat-based industrial gears and material handling equipment maker Elecon Engineering Ltd is likely to deliver a pair of marine gearbox to the public sector shipbuilding major, Cochin Shipyard Ltd (CSL) for construction of India's first indigenous aircraft carrier for the Indian Navy in the first quarter of the next fiscal, a source close to the development informed.

Elecon has joined hands with a German capital goods maker, Renk AG for a technical collaboration to build the marine gears for the Indian Navy. "The order for a pair of marine gears from Cochin Shipyard is likely to be delivered by the March 2012 or latest by the first quarter of the next fiscal. There were certain preconditions to qualify for the order. As a part of it, the company had entered into technical collaboration with German firm, Renk AG," said a senior official from Elecon.

"The components are manufactured at the company's facility in Vallabh Vidyanagar near Anand and then sent to Germany for testing required quality standards," he added.

Elecon was awarded the order in 2006 amounting to around Rs 39 crore for design, manufacture and supply of one set of marine gearbox from Cochin Shipyard Limited to construct India's first indigenous aircraft carrier for the Indian Navy.

Sources at Cochin Shipyard informed that the first phase of the construction of the carrier will be over by December-end that includes completion of the construction till the hull part of the carrier.

"By the end of this month, the first phase of contract would be over and the construction till hull part of the ship will be completed. The construction is largely progressing as per the schedule and comparable with the time taken by any global shipbuilding player," informed a source at Cochin Shipyard, not willing to be quoted.

The ship will be constructed in two phases with delivery to the Indian Navy scheduled in end-2014. CSL commenced steel cutting for the project in April 2005 and achieved the keel laying in February 2009.

The design and construction of the first indigenous aircraft carrier was sanctioned by the government of India in January 2003. The carrier has been designed by the Directorate of Naval Design (DND), only government-run organisation in the world to undertake indigenous design of warships. The carrier, with a a length of 260 meter and maximum breadth of 60 meters, is being constructed using high strength steel developed in-house with the help of DRDO and SAIL.

The ship will be propelled by two shafts, each coupled to two LM-2500 gas turbines developing a total power of 80 megawatt to attain speeds in excess of 28 knots.

The aircraft carrier will have two takeoff runways and a landing strip with three arrester wires. It can carry a maximum of 30 aircraft with an adequate hangarage capacity.

business-standard