F-22 Raptor

Rappel du premier message :

Dans ce qui suit, des extrait d'un certain nombre d'article sur le web parlant de cette terreur volant, je vous laisse admirer d'abord le charme de cette bête de combat.

Si le F-22 passe à l'exportation, s'en sera fini de la carrière à l'export du F-35

Pas tout à fait, les capacités multirôle du Raptor restant à être démontré..
Perso je pense pas à la chute du JSF bcp trop d'intéret en jeux dans plusieurs pays !

Le Japon commence a jouer la carte de concurence

Citation :

DATE:10/06/09
SOURCE:Flight International
Japan makes another push for F-22
By Siva Govindasamy

Japan is making a final push to buy the Lockheed Martin F-22 from the USA, and its defence minister has confirmed that Tokyo will consider alternatives including non-US fighters if the attempt fails.

"We are still seeking the possibility of acquiring the F-22, but if that does not work out, we will have to consider not just the [Lockheed] F-35, but others as options," Yasukazu Hamada told the Kyodo News Agency. "As of today, we still want to seek the F-22."

Within Washington, there are fresh calls to sell a fighter that Congress has barred from export due to its classified technology. US senator Daniel Inouye, who heads the Senate Appropriations Committee, supports a sale to Japan, the USA's closest military ally in east Asia.

In a recent letter to the Japanese ambassador, Inouye reportedly revealed that an export version of the F-22, which will come without the most sensitive technology, could cost $250 million. This includes the cost of developing an export model, something that would take up to five years. Deliveries would begin seven to nine years after a contract is signed, according to the US Air Force estimate.


Lockheed Martin


Japan has said that it wants to buy 50 fighters as part of its F-X requirement to replace its McDonnell Douglas F-4s, and the total bill for a Raptor acquisition could total $12.5 billion. Some observers, however, believe that Tokyo could go for fewer aircraft if it buys the F-22.

The unit cost would be much higher than the $150 million that the USAF paid for each aircraft in its last batch of four F-22s. US defence secretary Robert Gates said in April that the Department of Defense would halt production of the Raptor at 187 aircraft after ordering four more in fiscal year 2009.

Observers say that an export deal would allow Lockheed to keep its production line open and give Washington the option of buying additional F-22s in the future if it changes its mind.

Gates, however, opposes the sale and believes that Japan should instead consider the F-35, which has less stealth capability. The Pentagon, reiterating that US laws do not allow F-22 exports, adds: "That's why the secretary made the further point to his Japanese counterpart that the F-35 is the plane which we are pursuing and the plane that we would recommend the Japanese focus their efforts in terms of procuring in the future."

Apart from the F-22 and F-35, Tokyo has also asked for information on Boeing's F-15SE and F/A-18E/F Super Hornet, and the Eurofighter Typhoon as part of its F-X process. It could choose one of these as an interim solution in the event of delays to the Joint Strike Fighter.

Yakuza a écrit:

ca c´est du lobbyisme intelligent,mais l´embarras c´est si le Japon l´aura,l´UK en voudra,si ces 2 l´auront,quoi dire a Israel,et l´australie etc...un casse tete

si c'est le cas, les chances des F-15SE, F-35 et Typhoon seront sérieusement compromises. LM aura perdu la carte du JSF mais aura gagné celle du F-22, boeing par contre aura tout perdu, F-15SE et même le F-18E/F blkII/III. boeing en plus du F-15SE n'a toujours pas renoncé au F-18 blkIII contrairement à l'analyse quand avait fait au début comme quoi c'est ou l'un ou l'autre, boeing propose le blk III pour le projet KFX coréen avec nouveau design plus discret (peut être même des soutes d'armement) et augmentation de la poussée de 20%...
toute cette génération de chasseurs 4+/++... sera anéanti par l'arrivée du F-22 sur le marché, peut être même que par la même occasion son prix baissera à un niveau plus raisonnable, pour qu'il soit abordable pour des pays comme l'australie et le canada.

lit le dernier article,ca parle d´un probable Raptor "export"

ils veulent pas l'exporter ces américains! un modèle export à 100 M$ de plus l'unité par rapport au prix USAF et avec les ''most sensitive technology'' en moins! je comprend que la version export soit downgradée mais si c'est à ce prix là...je pense pas que ça va se vendre...

c´est une facon intelligente de les dissuader du chemin Raptor "voila on peut vous le vendre,mais,plus cher et moins sophistiqué"...ce qui equivaut a = achetez tout simplement un JSF
ou un SE alors..

Je crois que le Japon et d'autres alliés des US vont continuer la pression pour obtenir le F-22 et comme l'économie US marche en reculant, que seule son industrie de l'armement demeure à la pointe, que le F-35 semble traîner une vrai malédiction, il est probable que les US vont finir par céder.
Je pense quand même que le F-15SE est une bonne affaire pour ceux qui ne veulent pas attendre tres longtemps que les US cédent sur le F-22.

Citation :

U.S. sees big obstacles to F-22 exports
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. Air Force Chief of Staff General Norton Schwartz cited on Thursday "very substantial" legal, technical and timing obstacles to future exports of the radar-evading F-22 fighter jet, built by Lockheed Martin Corp.

Senator Daniel Inouye, head of the Senate Appropriations Committee, and other lawmakers have revived discussions about exports to extend the F-22 production line, given that Defense Secretary Robert Gates has decided to end U.S. production of the sophisticated fighter at 187 planes.
Inouye supports possible export of the fighter to Japan, which for years has expressed interest in buying the fighter.
Schwartz has testified to Congress that the military requirement for the F-22 remains at 243, but he told a Heritage Foundation event on Thursday that a smaller fleet of 187 would be "sufficient" and "adequate" for the U.S. Air Force to fulfill its mission of securing the skies
Schwartz said there are substantial obstacles to exports, including a legal ban on F-22 sales overseas; technical issues that make revamping the airplane for export very expensive; and the issue of whether the production line would still be open by the time any exports were approved.
He said he doubted Gates would change his position opposing exports, even to trusted allies.
"The pragmatic obstacles are very substantial," Schwartz said. "The technical, legal and timing aspects of this are very significant."
Foreign sales of the F-22 fighter are banned under an amendment by House Appropriations Committee Chairman David Obey that was first passed in 1998.
Congressional aides said recent North Korean missile launches and continued interest by Japan in buying the F-22 were softening congressional opposition, particularly since the F-22 production line is now nearing a shutdown.
Some lawmakers were also supportive of continuing domestic production of the plane, which would help maintain the production line until exports could begin, reducing any costs associated with restarting the line, said the aides.
"It's in our hands, and it's not out of the question at all," said one aide, who asked not to be named since the matter was still being considered by lawmakers.
The issue of protecting critical technologies was also a surmountable problem, given that 95 percent of the components on the F-22 were the same as the F-35, the aide said.
Schwartz said the plan is for F-22s to operate in tandem with a much larger fleet of F-35 fighters, also built by Lockheed and eight international partners.
To make that program successful, it would be vital to reach high enough production rates of F-35 fighter planes to keep the price of the new aircraft competitive for the U.S. military services and foreign partners involved in its development.
He said annual production of the new fighters needs to climb to at least 80 airplanes, and ideally as high as 110, to replace aging U.S. fighters and keep costs low.
Schwartz also said he opposes any move to beef up current fourth-generation fighters such as the Boeing Co F-15 as a bridge to the fifth generation F-35, citing the need to "make the leap" to the new plane and keep the unit cost for those airplanes competitive.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/11/AR2009061102407.html

le F-22 c'est l'USAF! je vois mal comment l'amérique peut partager ce symbole d'hégémonie avec les autres, mêmes ses alliés les plus fidèles.

Citation :

AF ready for F-22 export version

By Sam LaGrone - Staff writer
Posted : Sunday Jun 14, 2009 12:00:45 EDT

The Air Force is prepared to create a version of the F-22 Raptor that the U.S. could sell to foreign countries if it gets the go-ahead from Congress and the State Department, according to one of the service’s top acquisition officers.
Lt. Gen. Mark Shackelford told the Senate Armed Services air and land forces subcommittee that the Air Force would follow established practices to ensure the export model did not jeopardize U.S. military secrets.
“We would go into the process dealing with the State Department policy crowd and using normal foreign military sales processes,” Shackelford, military deputy in the Office of the Assistant Secretary of the Air Force for acquisition, said June 9 in response to remarks by Sen. John Thune, R-S.D.
It was the second time in less than a week the question of foreign sales came up at a Senate hearing. Five days earlier, at a Senate Appropriations subcommittee hearing, Sen. Daniel Inouye, D-Hawaii, asked the Air Force’s top two leaders — Chief of Staff Gen. Norton Schwartz and Secretary Michael Donley — what it would take to sell the stealth fighter abroad. After the hearing, Inouye said Japanese officials had asked him about the possibility of creating an F-22 export version. Australia also has expressed interest in buying the F-22.
Currently, a federal law enacted to keep sensitive military technology from hostile governments prevents both countries from acquiring the Raptor.
Japan has said it would pay the estimated $1 billion it would cost to develop an F-22 export model. The $140 million F-22 is one of six potential contenders to replace Japan’s aging fleet of F-4s. The F-35 Lightning II Joint Strike Fighter is another possibility.
In May, Defense Secretary Robert Gates recommended Japan go with the F-35 instead of the F-22. A month earlier, in his 2010 budget recommendation, Gates made clear his vision for the fifth-generation fighter fleet: the F-35 with a helping hand from the F-22. His plan calls for capping Raptor production at 187 aircraft — the goal once had been 381 — and bringing on 513 F-35s over the next five years. The last F-22 will roll off the production line in 2011.
Shackelford told Thune a foreign nation interested in acquiring the fighter would have to foot the bill to convert it.
“The F-22 that the United States flies would not be the same F-22 country ‘X’ flies,” Shackelford said.
“Keeping the F-22 line hot” with a foreign sales market could mitigate problems with bringing the F-35 online, Thune said.
The South Dakota senator and other observers say they worry that Gates is committing to the F-35 too early in its test program and that the U.S. will be left with a fighter gap if the Joint Strike Fighter fails to live up to expectations. The F-35s are replacing more than 800 of the Air Force’s oldest F-15s and F-16s, slated for decommissioning by 2024.

http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2009/06/airforce_tactical_061409/

A votre avis, les USA céderont-ils aux Japs et le F-22 va t-il devenir exportable (dans une version downgradée)

avec une version non-sophistiquée, et plus chere que le vrai Raptor,voyons
c´est une facon diplomatique pour pousser les japs a prendre soit JSF ou F-15SE,c´est juste mon avis.

voila ce qui va réjouir certains Raptors parmi nous

Citation :

House Committee Adds Funding for Lockheed Martin F-22
Lockheed Martin Corp.'s F-22 Raptor fighter has received a surprise boost from House lawmakers who want to add $369 million to the Pentagon's 2010 budget to ensure continued production of the Air Force's most advanced jet.

The proposed additional funding, agreed to by the House Armed Services Committee, is a surprise opening move in the Congressional contest over the Pentagon's weapons spending plans. Defense Secretary Robert Gates hopes to use the plans to rebalance the U.S. military's abilities to fight insurgent enemies encountered in Afghanistan and Iraq.
The proposal, which will have to wind its way through the House and Senate, is sure to come under scrutiny from the White House, which didn't want funding toward new planes in the 2010 budget. The committee voted 31 to 30 on the amendment.
In a statement, Lockheed said it "remains confident that the Congressional review process will lead to a healthy and full examination of budgetary and economic impacts, strategy, force structure and threats." It added that, as the Pentagon's largest contractor, Lockheed "will continue to support our customers and work to deliver affordable solutions that meet their strategic and operational needs."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124525444995823693.html

FAMAS a écrit:

voila ce qui va réjouir certains Raptors parmi nous

itoube

spéciale dédicace à tous les fans du dinosaure:

F/A-22A Breaking Sound Barrier :

Spoiler:

belle photo MW

Citation :

The F-22 Mud Fighter

July 4, 2009: The U.S. Air Force is upgrading all of its F-22s to better handle ground attack missions. This will include modifying the aircraft radar to do ground mapping and act as an electronic weapon. The AN/APG-77 radar on the F-22 has been tweaked so that it can produce photo-realistic images of what's on the ground. The AN/APG-77 is an AESA type radar, which consist of thousands of tiny radars that can be independently aimed in different directions. With sufficiently powerful computers on board, the AESA radar signals bounced back to the transmitter can be reassembled to provide a very realistic looking picture of what's out there.

AESA type radars have been around a long time, popular mainly for their ability deal with lots of targets simultaneously. But AESA is also able to focus a concentrated beam of radio energy that could scramble electronic components of a distant target. Sort of like the EMP (Electromagnetic Pulse) put out (in all directions) by nuclear weapons. AESA has demonstrated that it can disable missiles and aircraft. Ballistic missiles are another story, as they are sturdier (to handle re-entry stress) and have fewer electronics to mess with.

An F-22 with the ability to use its radar to identify vehicles on the ground is not a real big deal. That's because many less expensive aircraft can do the same thing. Targeting pods are used for this all the time, although the AESA radar approach cuts through clouds, fog and sand storms. But if this approach were important enough, an AESA radar and computers could be mounted in, say, a B-52, that could then drop missiles or smart bombs on targets it found.

Recently, an F-22 successfully dropped a SDB (Small Diameter Bomb) for the first time. An F-22 can carry eight SDBs internally. It was only three years ago that the 250 pound SDB into service, when an F-15E fighter bomber used one in Iraq. SDB is not just another "dumb bomb" with a GPS guidance kit attached. The SDB had a more effective warhead design and guidance system. It's shape is more like that of a missile than a bomb (70 inches long, 190 millimeters in diameter), with the guidance system built in. The smaller blast from the SDB will result in fewer civilian casualties when used in an urban area. Friendly troops can be closer to the target when an SDB explodes. While the 500, 1,000 and 2,000 pound bombs have a spectacular effect when they go off, they are often overkill. The troops on the ground would rather have more, smaller, GPS bombs available. This caused the 500 pound JDAM to get developed quickly and put into service.

The SDB is basically an unpowered missile, which can also glide long distances. This makes the SDB even more compact, capable and expensive (about $70,000 each.) JDAM (a guidance kit attached to a dumb bomb) only cost about $26,000. The small wings allow the SDB to glide up to 70-80 kilometers (from high altitude.) SDB also has a hard front end that can punch through several feet of rock or concrete, and a warhead that does more damage than the usual dumb bomb (explosives in a metal casing.) The SDB is thus the next generation of smart bombs.

There was never any point in building a 250 pound dumb bomb, as they would be too inaccurate to be useful. So it made sense to merge the guidance kit and the bomb itself. But the superiority of guided bombs is such that the next generation of heavier (500-2000 pound) smart bombs will probably be like the SDB.

The air force sees the F-22, using AESA for finding a target for its SDBs, as a formidable ground attack system. One reason for doing this is that first 63 F-22s built are not able to handle another upgrade that will enhance air-to-air performance. Thus these F-22 "mud fighters" will be useful for ground attack missions, especially those that require some stealth.

http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htairfo/articles/20090704.aspx

La Air National Guard veut des F-22.

Citation :

ANG Director's F-22 appeal to Congress

July 9, 2009 (by Bjørnar Bolsøy) - The Air National Guard is becoming a force to be reckoned with in the battle over whether to terminate or keep building the 5th generation F-22 fighter.


In a June 19 letter to Senator Saxby Chambliss (R-GA), Air National Guard Director Lt. Gen. Harry Wyatt advocates the purchase of F-22 fighters to secure the Guard's homeland defense mission in the future. According to Wyatt the ANG is facing a serious risk of becoming unable to fulfill the Nations highest strategic priority: defending the Homeland.

Wyatts concern is well founded. Within about eight years 80 percent of the ANG's F-16 inventory, which carries out the bulk of the Nations Air Sovereignty Alert (ASA) operations, will reach the end of their planned operational life span.

In his April testimony to the House Armed Services’ readiness committee, Wyatts noted that if Air Guard units received 5th generation fighters, such as the F-22 and F-35 sooner, the readiness issues could be avoided. "Every day without a solution, this situation becomes more and more urgent," Wyatt told the committee.

The Air Guard operates 16 of the 18 ASA sites located across the United States to protect its airspace. While the average age of Guard' aircraft is over 25 years, the KC-135 aerial refueling tanker aircraft are the oldest at 49 years. The KC-135s also support the ASA mission through aerial refueling. In total, excluding tanker support, more than 3,000 Airmen are responsible for the Air Sovereignty Alert mission.

In the June letter to Senator Chambliss, Wyatt remains optimistic in the US's ability to recapitalize the ANG, but notes "I am not aware of any plan that commits to doing so". "As such, we are in need of an immediate solution in order to ensure that America's most cost effective force can continue to perform its most important mission".

Wyatt continues, advocating the capabilities of Lockheed Martins F-22 fighter: "While a variety of solutions abound, I believe the current and future asymmetric threats to our nation, particularly from seaborne cruise missiles, requires a fighter platform with the requisite speed and detection to address them." "The F-22's unique capability in this arena enables it to handle a full spectrum of threats that the ANG's current legacy systems are not capable of addressing", Wyatt said emphasizing its 5th generation capacity.

“I am fond of saying that America's most important job should be handled by Americas best fighter".

The Armed Services panel’s report accompanying its recent defense authorization bill quotes Wyatts letter as a justification for the committee’s recommendation to keep the F-22 production line open. The report suggests that the looming shortfall of F-15 and F-16 fighter jets to execute the Air Guard's ASA alerts is a primary reason for authorizing the additional F-22s.

Wyatts letter concludes: "Many say this will mean making though choices, but I believe we can maintain our vitality by making smart choices; leveraging the cost effective and daily use of the ANG is the answer. Basing F-22s (and eventually F-35s) at strategic locations while simultaneously making them available to rotationally support worldwide contingency operations is the most responsible approach to satisfying all of our Nation's needs".

http://www.f-16.net/news_article3614.html

Citation :

Le Sénat d'accord avec Obama pour renoncer aux F-22 supplémentaires
De THE ASSOCIATED PRESS (CP) – il y a 1 heure

WASHINGTON — Le Sénat américain s'est rangé du côté de Barak Obama mercredi en votant la suppression d'une enveloppe de 1,75 milliard de dollars (1,23 million d'euros) destinée à la construction de sept avions de chasse F-22 Raptors supplémentaires.

Les sénateurs ont suivi le président par 58 voix contre 40, estimant que le programme initial de 187 avions de combat suffisait. Le ministre de la Défense Robert Gates avait jugé que les besoins opérationnels du Pentagone étaient satisfaits avec le programme de 140 millions de dollars.

Quant au président Obama, il avait menacé de mettre son veto au projet de loi de la Défense si le Congrès passait outre son avis.

De nombreux parlementaires s'opposaient à la suppression du programme complémentaire car la construction des F-22 de Lockheed Martin représente des emplois dans leur Etat ou leur circonscription.

Citation :

DATE:21/07/09
SOURCE:Flight International
Senate votes to stop F-22 production
By Stephen Trimble

The US Senate today voted to end production of Lockheed Martin F-22s after 2011, overturning a challenge to the Obama Administration's defence budget priorities with a surprising 18-vote majority.

The Senate voted 58-40 to strip $1.75 billion for buying seven more F-22s beyond the 187 funded in the current programme of record. The money had been added in June by the powerful Senate Armed Services Committee.

The issue attracted a strong response from reform-minded senators, led by Democrat Carl Levin and Republican John McCain, as well as a rare veto threat by President Barack Obama.

Gates personally lobbied senators over the last two weeks and made several statements calling for halting further production of the F-22. In Gates's view, the 187 currently in the fleet satisfied the US Air Force's requirements, with 2,400 Lockheed F-35s and hundreds of unmanned aircraft also planned to be purchased.

The F-22's supporters, however, claimed that closing the F-22 production line would needlessly sacrifice thousands of jobs and put the USAF's air superiority mission at risk.

The House of Representatives has already split with the Obama Administration on the F-22. The House has inserted about $360 million in the Fiscal 2010 budget to buy long-lead parts to build 12 more F-22s. At least $2 billion more is required next year to complete the deal.

The Senate vote sets up a confrontation with House leaders about their differences on continuing F-22 production. A single-version of the budget must be submitted to President Obama before it can be signed into law.

Meanwhile, Lockheed Martin chief financial officer Bruce Tanner, speaking today to financial analysts, delivered a pessimistic forecast about the F-22's export chances to Japan or any other foreign buyer.

"I'm not particularly positive on the ability for us to make [an F-22 export deal] happen in the next few years," Tanner says.

Stopper la production du f-22 Ils sont fous ces Yankees

Citation :

F-22 Raptor News
USAF release F-22 accident report

July 31, 2009 (by AFMC) - Air Force Materiel Command officials released an accident investigation report that determined that human factors associated with high gravitational forces caused the March 25 crash of an F-22 test aircraft 35 miles outside of Edwards AFB.


The test pilot, David Cooley, a Lockheed Martin employee, was killed in the mishap.

Mr. Cooley was a former Air Force pilot with significant flight experience, including in the F-22. The aircraft, assigned to the Air Force Flight Test Center at Edwards AFB, was destroyed. Total cost of the aircraft, equipment damage and property restoration has been estimated at $155 million.

According to the report, Mr. Cooley was conducting high-G maneuvers, which test aircraft capabilities and integrated equipment, prior to the accident. Witness statements, voice and telemetry data and simulations show he completed two of three planned tests. During his third test maneuver, however, he appeared to have been subjected to increased physiological stressors associated with high-G maneuvers, according to the report.

The board concluded this led to an "almost" loss of consciousness and lack of situational awareness, causing Mr. Cooley to delay his aircraft recovery maneuver.

The report states, "The [mission test pilot] regained partial [situational awareness] and attempted a late recovery from the test maneuver but determined there was inadequate altitude for a safe recovery and ejected."

Due to the speed of the aircraft and the windblast, the pilot immediately sustained fatal, blunt force trauma injuries upon ejection.

The accident board concluded that the aircraft itself was functioning normally and that there were no design or airworthiness issues that would impact the safe operation of the F-22 fleet.

"The loss of Mr. Cooley is tragic and keenly felt by everyone who knew him," said Maj. Gen. David W. Eidsaune, the Accident Investigation Board president. He was a superior test pilot and a member of the Air Force family. His service as a test pilot helped enhance the capabilities of fighter aircraft. Our thoughts and prayers continue to include the Cooley family."

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